NWD: This is the first time in the history of the American Student Dental Association (ASDA) that both the president and vice-president come from the same school. How did this happen?

Marcus: We were just blessed with an opportunity.  What we have is a very strong local chapter.  There are many qualified leaders who could step up to the level of a trustee or Executive Committee member, but without a strong local chapter, most of these people feel obliged to continue to work at that level to help the local chapter survive.

Sayeed: In fact, that was one of the biggest issues that came up at our House of Delegates. The House looks for diversity, well-roundedness.  It took a lot of extra work on our part to convince the delegates ñdonÍt look at where weÍre from, look at credentials.î  ThatÍs basic: Who is most qualified to run.  We have a phenomenal Executive Committee this year, so it wasnÍt just us carrying this message.

Marcus: [laughs] We had to pitch ourselves, too: Look at the fine print, at how different we are. Sayeed has the legislative background; I went the governance route. We could bring a balance to the committee.

Sayeed: Our competition came from Temple and UCLA, so it was a real campaign. Marcus and I collaborated in the beginning, talked about issues, but we did platforms, speeches and caucus visits completely separately.  We didnÍt want to run as ñthe Minnesota team.î

Marcus: All our junior year we talked about issues, educated each other; but for the campaign, we didnÍt want ñoverlap.î  We wanted original ideas.

NWD: Where did organized dentistry come in?

Sayeed: [laughs] Initial involvement in disorganized dentistry! I didnÍt know much about dentistry in high school and college even though both our fathers are dentists. When I came to the U, I became the ASDA class rep „thatÍs essentially where it started.  Then some upper classmen talked to me about helping with some legislative issues.  The MDA was involved with a bill in the House concerning the largest third-party payer in the state. There wasnÍt going to be a hearing, but the students did a huge letter-writing campaign, and the letters gave them a perspective that persuaded them to grant the hearing.  It was awesome „ that sparked it all. ItÍs your life, itÍs your profession, itÍs definitely how you are going to be able to treat your patients.  If youÍre not out there advocating for your patientsÍ rights, someone else will, and chances are they wonÍt have the patientsÍ best interests in mind, because if they did, they would be treating them.  After that it just snowballed.

Marcus: I got snowballed, too. [laughter]  Mine was a little different: mention of a potential ñkids dayî outreach program, teaching oral hygiene to elementary age kids.  I went to Liz Thelemann (who did so much she ended up National Delegate of the Year!). Liz sent me to Matt Krishce, who was leaving the country and put me in charge as co-chair!  I remember his words:  ñIt can seem overwhelming, but just pick a pet project and go to it.î  ThatÍs what I did.  We did it, and it went very well.  So Matt comes back and says, ñYou could even be president!î  And he started mentoring me to run for his national position.  That got me excited.  Then hanging out with Liz and Sayeed showed me the other issues.  So I came in more for the non-profit side of it, helping people, standing up for people, at which point I realized dentistry needed to be stood up for, too.

Sayeed: I think mentorship is huge.  We knew that within the School, but also in organized dentistry.  They really help guide you to see how everything works.

Marcus: Mentors from the ADA are how we got up to speed so quickly.  I had Dr. Brandjord, our Tenth District trustee.

NWD: Does being in such close proximity help get things done?

Sayeed:  I think it was phenomenal, but sometimes we had to, ah, ñre-focusî on dentistry. [laughs]  WeÍve even pulled clinic instructors ñoff taskî as we discuss issues while cleaning up after seeing patients.  The synergy was great.  The biggest challenge was not to let the other executive team members feel left out.

NWD: So how many full-time jobs do you guys have?

Sayeed: Pretty close to every waking minute.  ASDA has to educate its new leaders.  We have leadership conferences in fall and winter to do that.  ASDA has become known as one of the best training grounds for organized dental leaders.  A bonus from large turnover is a pool of fresh ideas and enthusiastic leaders.  They have become really good at building each other up.  And the Central Office is key to ASDAÍs success.  The Chicago staff is the glue that keeps everyone together

NWD: What are the main areas ASDA is working on now?

Sayeed: Right now graduate medical education monies that provide funding and residency programs in hospitals, including hospital beds.  We have been working closely with the ADA Washington office.  Marcus worked a lot in governance.  There are membership issues.  We have more than 15,000 members but a very small central office, and weÍre trying to get that ñfour-star serviceî back.  You are always ultimately a member-based association, so you need to make sure members are getting what they want and need.

Marcus: WeÍre always concerned about continuity.   A big accomplishment this last year was creating a database of all our information to make it accessible, searchable... plus we have lots of PowerPoint presentations, which weÍre trying to put on the Web site.

Sayeed: A lot of our meetings are for potential new members who request the information theyÍve been exposed to, but we havenÍt been able to do that for them quickly.  We want to empower local leaders to give those presentations at their schools. Hopefully that will make stronger chapters.

NWD: Orient us to where you are in your terms.

Sayeed: Our Annual Session is the last week in August. The president and two vice-presidents serve one-year terms. Then the president serves one year as past-president. We donÍt have presidents-elect, so essentially the only continuity is the past-president.  WeÍve been talking about forming a sort of Former ASDA Leaders Executive Committee.

Marcus: That and, without micromanaging, building a Central Office staff who want to be there for the long haul.  We need retention because they are our institutional memory.

Sayeed: ItÍs all time-consuming. The new Executive Committee came in with a list of goals, and we have done half to three-quarters of them. And we travel. January through March I hadnÍt been in Minnesota for two consecutive weekends.

Marcus: Every time my dad calls me, IÍm in another airport.

Sayeed: Taking that much time off was a learning curve for us and the School.  WeÍve had a lot of support from the School, but we did have to explain what we were doing and the time ñoffî required.  WeÍre dental students first.  The teachers want you to do the work right and they donÍt want to bend on that, so we assured them the flexibility needed had to do with scheduling.  WeÍd like to thank Laura Bolland, Gale Shea, our group leader Dr. Nadeau in senior clinics and Dr. Donna Mattschek.

Marcus: I remember some crazy sessions where I saw so many patients people were saying, ñAre you running a practice?î

Sayeed: Which is good practice!

Marcus: But we utilized every spare fragment of time.

Sayeed: Having such a tight schedule, there is no transition necessary to the outside world.  Granted, you have to be a good speaker, you have to be prepared, run a good meeting, be current with the trustees and the issues, then over here you have to be a good dental student, clinician, listener, take exams, not fall asleep, and at home you have

to be a good boyfriend, fiancee, son, friend „ without exploding at somebody. I think it brought out the best in Marcus and me.  It was a unique challenge, but when youÍre running at that level, youÍre going find out who you are. There were times when we took a vacation from each other.

NWD: How about MDA support?

Sayeed: Phenomenal. Dawn Jensen for the local chapter. I think the MDA and our local ASDA chapter have one of the best relationships in the country.  At first the other states thought Minnesota was crazy to be so involved with the students, but now they are coming to us saying, ñHow did you do that?  We want to do that, too. î Chapter building is one of the biggest kicks in the Career Development section.  ItÍs good for the Association, too, because it reminds longtime practitioners what square one was like and keeps new information in front of the membership.

Marcus: We personally thank the MDA for this opportunity.  I donÍt think it would have happened without them.  Our Student District is this strong because the MDA chose to stand behind it.  Look at the trust they placed in us when they gave us the opportunity to step up to the plate when Sayeed went to the Capitol as a first-year dental student.

Sayeed: Having a solid foundation at home allows you to spread your wings „ and now in our turn we can ñbring it home.î

NWD: Is the process producing more national participants?

Sayeed: Tim Osborn, a junior, is running for national office this August.  WeÍll see how the House handles ñanother Minnesota guy.î

Marcus: WeÍve done that for a lot of people.

NWD: Is the ASDA Eighth Region strong for national leadership?

Sayeed: Yes, very strong.

Marcus: From a trustee perspective, this is very interesting:  You have strong chapters like Minnesota and Iowa.  Iowa actually built on our model.  We want now to focus on weak chapters to continue that development.  Programming, making things from scratch, is so time-consuming for dental students; but by showing them the specifics that go with an idea, youÍre modeling how to do more and be leaders.

NWD: We understand there was some initial opposition to student delegates actually having more votes than some states.

Marcus: Our standing is one of the ways the ADA is responding to the need to recognize not only ethnic and gender diversity but also age.  In fact, they have started a program mentoring mid-career and new dentists into the leadership process.  This will bring different perspectives every time they come to the table.  Most members donÍt know, for instance, what the student debt load is.

Sayeed: In so many ways we are trying to reduce that gap between the high ASDA membership and the lower new dentist membership in the ADA.  I think dentists need to make the same change in mindset we make going from the state chapter to the national level.  WeÍre students for four years, but we will be dentists for life. Also consider that most dental  students are older, have families... And while ASDA is good-sized, weÍre scattered all over the country. Just remember, everybody wants to be heard.

NWD: And doesnÍt national leadership want new dentists who want to make a contribution?

Sayeed: Achieving credibility is huge. [laughs] IÍm not saying I have itƒ But at ASDA we train for that.  We work hard to make sure that no matter how emotional the issue, the students have their facts right and have heard both sides of the argument.

Marcus: We had to learn to strategize, work the floor, lobby members.  What you have when youÍre done, win or lose, is 12 ASDA members who feel comfortable with the process, who can speak on issues and who want to be delegates and actually help.  We work 13, 14 hours a day.   We have time to do it because we caucus after the other districts, but let me tell you, when that work converts a 10 percent possibility to an 86 percent pass vote, you feel incredible. ThatÍs sweet success.

NWD: How do you divide the responsibilities of your offices?

Marcus: Our Executive Committee consists of three officers: a president and two vice-presidents.  WeÍve been floored by how well this works.  Sayeed is the agitator: legislative, the grassroots network, financial.  We can send him anywhere, and we know people will listen. Kari Foster keeps it all moving.

Sayeed: And Marcus keeps it all together. With his governance background, he knows what makes ASDA run and what could make things better.

NWD: How do you improve a chapter?

Sayeed: Find out member levels, ASDA presence, programs, articles published, any national leaders. Is it an active chapter?  We use the diplomatic route, perhaps a site visit. We give them as many resources as possible.  We work with the school, too, because school support is immense. They can be either bridge-builders or obstacles.

Marcus: The ADA has offered its help, but we have to let them know what we need. We have a governance system that focuses our consultants on one special project.  One consultant will focus on one weak chapter to rebuild.  That personÍs job will be a site visit and streaming ideas into a program via direct contact.

Sayeed: People, resources and budget are the biggest things.  The right person with the right idea can be so energizing, but finding that person is three quarters of the challenge. There might be a national assistance fund for the latter, or a sponsorship program.

NWD: So your first hire is an Executive Director. [They laugh] This isnÍt rehearsal, is it? You are not an auxiliary to the ADA.  Students taking on this involvement need to know that.  How about personal goals when youÍre an officer.  Is that even a possibility by the time you get there?

Sayeed: A little bit. ThereÍs definitely a responsibility to what is ongoing when you come on for a single-year term.  Areas are legislative, governance, issues and membership.  And weÍve been working on a strategic plan.

Marcus: The way weÍve restructured consultants, when we come to our last meeting in August, we will move through not only the bills for our Annual Session but positions, issues and focus. When the new group comes in, theyÍll have the continuity of a ñminiî strategic plan.  WeÍll have to do some education and coaching on policies.  And we think tracking former ASDA leaders into ADA positions, for instance, would also be a great idea.

NWD: How about your own short- and long-term plans?

Sayeed: General practice in St. Cloud, Minn., with my father, and IÍd like to teach here in the School.  And definitely stay involved in organized dentistry. I think once you do it, it becomes a way of life.

Marcus: Initially an oral surgery internship with Dr. Bruce Templeton at the VA hospital. My fiancee is working on her doctorate in school psychology.  So this is a year of discernment for me . And IÍll stay in organized dentistry - at a manageable pace!  Sayeed and I have talked about political ambitions down the road because we are interested in so many issues.

NWD: Two-career, new-dentist families must be an ASDA issue.

Sayeed: Absolutely. And access-to-care has been a hot item.  But the biggest is education.  We did a survey of 800 students:  The number-one concern was worry they wouldnÍt be able to support their families and pay off their debt, especially if they go to a smaller town.  The overall umbrella of financial burden was by far the biggest concern. This wasnÍt a solicited comment; we had several other questions about practice opportunity, different areas, arts and entertainment, size of community.  Students were worried that ñsmaller communityî translated to ñconstricted environment.î   We have to knock down that preconception because it is not the case.  DonÍt worry „ the financial resources are there.

Marcus: ItÍs also a misconception that the majority of ñruralî patients are going to be MA.  Like all public policies, it could be a good idea to offer people an incentive to help pay off that loan, but they have to make the system work.

Sayeed: The Indian Health Service has a wonderful loan repayment program, but like public assistance, there are a lot of roadblocks in what should be an efficiently run program. We need to remove barriers.

NWD: What is the student debt now?

Sayeed: WeÍve had 17, 14 and 14 percent increases in tuition since we have been here.  We have been told our debt has been raised about $50-60,000 just because of the state budget cuts.  Average is $100-128,000 for our class.  They are telling the first-years $160-170,000 just to get them prepared.

NWD: How do you work with the American Dental Education Association (ADEA)?

Sayeed: ASDA is the bigger player.  ADEA is for school administration.  We have a joint lobby day, and weÍve been trying to work together more.  ADEA has the upper hand in research, demographics, data, everything that makes lobbying successful.  We have the grassroots network.

NWD: Each of you is about to take that ñnext big stepî in your profession and in life. Play valedictorian to your own graduation for a littleƒ

Sayeed: ItÍs been a great year for us in office „ and weÍre still friends!  ItÍs been a great year in dental school, the best four years.  If I could address one thing to the dentists out there, I would say, ñPlease try mentoring.î  Remember how it was for you, and remember the good days in dental school.  Make it that way for someone else as much as you can. These people will be your colleagues.

Marcus: Mine would be, this has been a tremendous opportunity to learn about dentistry, to know much more about dentistry than just the face value „ to dive deep into dentistry and know the good, the bad „ there is ugly „ but to know the incredibly beautiful things that we do

.

Believe in the students.  The students want to make the right calls.  The students have the best interests of the Association at heart.  ItÍs a cliche, but most of the students come in with very, very big ears, and we are going to bring a fresh perspective.

To the students:  You have to find your own identity, and then where you fit.  Be involved in your specialty, in your individual causes, but go to bat for dentistry as a whole.

WeÍre happy that people have trusted us, and hope they will allow us to continue to speak.